textfiles-politics/txt_files/white.sko

From bigxc@firefly.prairienet.orgFri Jan 20 07:28:13 1995
Date: Sun, 1 Jan 95 11:14:36 CST
From: Brian Redman <bigxc@firefly.prairienet.org>
To: Multiple recipients of list <conspire@argus.cso.uiuc.edu>
Subject: Sherman Skolnick -- Whitewater Update


SHERMAN SKOLNICK -- WHITEWATER UPDATE
 
Tom Valentine's guest on *Radio Free America* (Shortwave, 5.065 
MHz, mon-fri, 9 pm cst) on November 30, 1994 was independent 
researcher and founder of the Citizens Committee to Clean-up the 
Courts [CCCC], Mr. Sherman Skolnick. Note that views expressed in 
the following do not necessarily reflect my own views or those of 
Conspiracy Nation.
 
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[Awesome sounds of John Phillip Souza's "Stars and Stripes Forever"]
 
ANNOUNCER:
It's *Radio Free America*, the talk show for intelligent 
Americans, with your host, Tom Valentine.
 
*Radio Free America* is brought to you by *The Spotlight* [CN -- 
Note: Throw mud here.] Call 1-800-522-6292 for your subscription.
 
And now, the newspaper that "tells it like it is" presents Tom 
Valentine.
 
 
TOM VALENTINE:
Hello, everybody. Welcome back, to *Radio Free America*.
 
And here we are: the third of the last three broadcasts at 
daytime; gonna be shifting to night, coming Monday. (That will be 
December the 5th, I believe.)
 
So, today, because the Senate is busy debating GATT, and because 
we have "GATT-ed" ourselves out -- we've made our case, now if... 
The jury's out and if the prostitutes in our Congress do not 
listen to those who put 'em there but go to those who are payin' 
'em, then GATT will pass [and] there's not much we can do about 
it.
 
So. With that in mind, very much like yesterday's show, I'm 
reaching into *Radio Free America's* "bag of tricks", if you 
will, to some real classics. And I have a group of guests that 
give this show something that no other radio talk show can have, 
really.
 
So on the other end of the phone, out of Chicago, is Sherman 
Skolnick, the Committee to Clean-up the Courts. And if you will 
recall, a long time ago Sherman was a guest on this show and he 
predicted certain things about Whitewater.
 
So we're going to go back and look at the President of the United 
States and Arkansas and this scandal that has lost a lot of press 
coverage. Because of other events, we haven't heard much about 
Whitewater and so forth.
 
So Sherman, welcome back to *Radio Free America*.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
Good afternoon to all of your listeners. I'm pleased to be on 
your show again, Tom.
 
More than a year ago, I said exclusively on your show that a 
federal grand jury, meeting in Little Rock [, Arkansas] and 
elsewhere, was in a position to target, for federal criminal 
charges, President Clinton and the first lady. And I'm sure some 
people shook their heads to say, "Hey. This fellow Skolnick, from 
Chicago: does he know what he's talking about?"
 
Well, I've been doin' this type of work, heading up a research 
and investigation group, for more than 32 years. And we know what 
we're doin'. A number of high-level judges have gone to jail 
because of our work. And we've "got our ear to the ground."
 
Now, the *Los Angeles Times* has started a preliminary story 
which has been summarized, for example, in the *Chicago Tribune*, 
November 25th, where they say that there are about to be 
Whitewater indictments by special counsel Kenneth Starr, 
including, reportedly, against Arkansas governor Jim "Guy" 
Tucker...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Now *that's* been in the news.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Right.
 
..former U.S. Associate Attorney General Webster Hubbell, which 
is third in command, and others.
 
 
VALENTINE:
That's *not* been in the news all that much. I haven't seen the 
newspapers bandying Hubbell's name about with these indictments.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
I'm just lookin' at the story from the *Los Angeles Times*, with 
the *Los Angeles Times* dateline.
 
But notice the paragraph: "But there is no indication *so* *far* 
that Starr is considering seeking indictments against President 
Clinton or first lady Hillary Rodham Clinton."
 
Well [laughs], I tell ya somethin': at the very minimum, the 
President and the first lady are going to be, what is known in 
law, shown as "unindicted co-conspirators", which is just a 
*hair* away from an actual federal criminal indictment. In other 
words, they're *part* of the deal, but for whatever practical or 
other reasons they are not named as actual federal criminal 
indictments. And that, apparently, is where the matter stands.
 
But in order to understand the whole thing, we have to back up a 
little bit. And here are some key dates that I want your 
listeners to carefully consider.
 
July 19th, 1993. An elite unit of the FBI, under the direct 
supervision of the FBI director who, up to that day, was William 
Sessions. They were investigating high-level criminality. And 
they had targeted... well, they had come across information 
showing criminal offenses committed by Bill Clinton and his wife.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right, hold on. We've got that date, July the 19th, 1993. My 
guest, Sherman Skolnick, Committee to Clean-up the Courts, out of 
Chicago. I'm Tom Valentine and this is *Radio Free America*.
 
[...break...]
 
Back live, *Radio Free America*. We're talking with Sherman 
Skolnick. And there are, evidently, developments in the grand 
jury situation down in Little Rock, Arkansas and the new special 
prosecutor, Mr. Starr. And not a lot has been published in the 
major media, although, Sherman, you're sayin' that the *Los 
Angeles Times* have started it.
 
So let's go back to these important dates now.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
By the way, this article [in the *Chicago Tribune*] was tucked in 
what they call the corner of the page, about halfway through the 
first section. If you didn't look carefully, you might miss it. 
But there it was, November 25th, '94. I read a couple paragraphs 
from it.
 
But getting back to the dates that I mentioned on the previous 
program but I'm going over it. July 19th, 1993. An elite unit, 
set up under the direct supervision of the FBI director at that 
time, William Sessions, had uncovered information of a criminal 
nature against the President and the first lady. What happened 
was, later that day, Sessions was "sacked" [i.e. fired] on what 
some feel were frivolous reasons: that he had failed to buy a 
separate plane ticket for his wife, who once or twice accompanied 
him on a plane for official business. He was "sacked" for that.
 
The next morning [i.e. July 20, 1993], a federal magistrate in a 
pending criminal case in Little Rock -- U.S. vs. David Hale. Hale 
was, at one time, a municipal judge, a state municipal judge, in 
Little Rock. In that case, the magistrate, working under the 
auspices of the district judge, ordered the release uh, 
divulging, of certain records that Clinton and his wife had which 
were in the custody of Vincent Foster, jr., White House aide. 
(Most people miss the point that, at that point, Foster was the 
personal attorney of the President and the first lady.)
 
That was the morning of July 20th, '93. That afternoon, something 
happened to Vincent Foster, jr.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Now wait a minute! Are you saying that Sessions was "canned" 
[i.e. fired] on the 19th, and Foster was killed on the 20th?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Yeah.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Oh. O.K.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Less than a... well, less than a day apart.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Is that right?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Yeah.
 
 
VALENTINE:
I didn't realize that! I thought Sessions was long gone when 
Foster was found dead.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
No, he was "canned" later that day [i.e. July 19, 1993]. Just at 
the point that the FBI elite unit, under his direct supervision, 
came up with the information showing that Bill Clinton and his 
wife committed federal criminal offenses.
 
Now later that afternoon, on the 20th, something happened to 
Foster. Some contend it was a suicide; others claim it's a 
murder. Whichever way you pick...
 
 
VALENTINE:
He's dead.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Yeah.
 
And then his office was ransacked while the FBI and others were 
not allowed to enter the office. They were kept in the hallway 
at, you know, away. And [Bernard] Nussbaum and others who were 
important in the White House at that time (but they later 
resigned) ransacked the office and took away records and said 
that the FBI cannot look at them.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right, now, all of this is very well-known and old news.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Right.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Right?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Yeah.
 
 
VALENTINE:
O.K.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Now. What happened thereafter is, some time later... Well first 
of all, let's detail what the David Hale thing is about.
 
He got involved in U.S. Small Business Administration loans of a 
massive amount. He contends that he was forced to "funnel" the 
money to Bill Clinton...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Yes!
 
 
SKOLNICK:
..by way of the ex-wife of James McDougal, the head of Madison 
Guaranty S&L of Little Rock. And Hale let it be known to some 
reporters... uh, not many reporters quite wanted to "go" with the 
story. But Hale, in so many words, says, "Look. I'm not 'going 
down'. Clinton's 'going down'. Cuz *he* got the money, I didn't."
 
In other words, Hale says, "I'm not going to jail for something 
that Clinton got the money." You see what I'm sayin'?
 
 
VALENTINE:
Um-hmm [affirmative]. I remember all of this. Larry Nichols came 
out with that story, yeah.
 
 
SHERMAN SKOLNICK:
O.K. But wait a minute.
 
January '94. A senior litigation attorney of the U.S. Small 
Business Administration, in Chicago, a close crony of the Rodham 
family of Park Ridge (a northwest suburb of Chicago. And the 
Rodham family, Hillary's family, is originally from Park Ridge), 
uh he kept following me around the courthouse. I'm a journalist 
and I come often to the courthouse, the state and federal 
courthouse, to watch cases, to interview people, and so on.
 
And I know this lawyer, and he kept, sort of, "dogging me". He'd 
stand near me and make small talk. Most lawyers are afraid of me 
because of our cable TV show here that "fingers" crooked lawyers 
and judges, so most of 'em won't be seen with me at all. But he 
kept standing near me.
 
Anyway, to make a long story short, I ended up with a former 
client of this man, John E. Gierum, of Park Ridge. I ended up 
outside his office in a vehicle. And he sat in the front seat of 
the car, next to me. And he confessed to me that the White House 
was in the works [of] trying to "frame" him on a series of 
situations amounting to millions and millions and millions of 
dollars.
 
And I said, "Well, you're a skilled lawyer." He says, "It won't 
help me." He says, "You'll probably soon get a collect call from 
me from a far-away jail." He says, "If they set about to 'frame' 
me, nothing can help me."
 
And among other things we discussed (as we had discussed 
exclusively on one of your earlier programs), the mysterious 
transfer of $50 million from a Resolution Trust Corporation [RTC] 
contingency fund...
 
 
TOM VALENTINE:
All right, well hold it. $50 million slips away from a 
contingency fund. And we will return to this.
 
My guest is Sherman Skolnick. I'm Tom Valentine, this is *Radio 
Free America*.
 
[...break...]
 
All right, now we're talkin' with Sherman Skolnick. And of course 
we're talking about Bill and Hillary Clinton, and they're, 
they're tangled into Whitewater (which has not been talked about 
much.) And right now, we're going back over old news, building up 
-- I assume, Sherman, we're building up to some new wrinkles on 
this.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Absolutely.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right now, before we...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
..trying to go about it step by step. I hope I'm not getting too 
technical. I'm trying to summarize some complicated events so 
that...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Well we've got, we've got a listener out here that wants to "give 
you what for" [i.e. challenge what Skolnick says]. She just 
doesn't like this.
 
Lilly, in Picayune, Mississippi. What's the matter with you, 
Lilly?
 
 
LILLY:
Well, not anything except a little bit of honesty. I would like 
for the, whatever his name is, to tell... I would like to ask him 
if he investigated "October Surprise" and Iran-Contra.
 
 
VALENTINE:
*Oh*, he sure did, ma'am.
 
 
LILLY:
Well. What did he come up with?
 
 
VALENTINE:
Oh, tell her what you think of George Bush!
 
 
LILLY:
Pardon me?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
He committed treason, ma'am. On the "October Surprise" and the 
Iran-Contra, as we have discussed on earlier programs with Tom 
Valentine, exclusively, we and associates of ours have been on 
the cutting edge of that. And there's an overlap there: George 
Bush and Ollie North were involved with the cocaine being 
smuggled into Mena, Arkansas airport, under the supervision of 
Governor Clinton.
 
 
LILLY:
Yeah, I know you had to bring up...
 
[...contention for who will speak...]
 
LILLY [continues]:
Hold it just a minute. Bush wasn't President at that time. Reagan 
was. Why is Reagan never mentioned in all this kind of stuff?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Uh, call up your local "news fakers" [laughs] and ask them!
 
 
LILLY:
Oh you're, you're the one that's on the radio.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Well, Lilly, hold it. Lilly, you see, you're in here two quarts 
low and four years late. But, but Sherman has been taking on... 
Hold it! Hold it.
 
 
LILLY:
..President. He...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Lilly!
 
 
LILLY:
..when this was supposed to have happened.
 
 
VALENTINE:
O.K. But, Lilly. You gotta learn to listen. Even though you're 80 
years old and you're a dyed-in-the-wool Democrat, you gotta learn 
to listen sometimes. *We* *don't* *favor* *either* *one*, the 
Republicans nor the Democrats.
 
 
LILLY:
I know.
 
 
VALENTINE:
And no matter how bad George Bush may be, it doesn't make Bill 
Clinton good.
 
 
LILLY:
No! I know that...
 
 
VALENTINE:
O.K.
 
 
LILLY:
..but...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Thank you, ma'am.
 
[...contention for who will speak...]
 
 
LILLY:
You see, Reagan was the President when all this happened.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
O.K. But ma'am, if you read *Spotlight* you know, to their 
credit, they ran exclusive stories, uncovered by myself, on an 
unpublicized court case here in the federal court showing that 
George Herbert Walker Bush was in business with Saddam Hussein at 
the time that our soldiers were in harms way in the Gulf [see 
Conspiracy Nation Vol. 2 Num. 20]. So to say that we haven't 
outlined a few things... *Spotlight* played it up quite big, as 
well as on *Radio Free America*. So it's been gone into.
 
I would prefer to use this time on the air to set forth, step by 
step, what we are about to summarize here about...
 
 
VALENTINE:
So would I! Lilly, I just want you to listen! You gotta learn to 
listen!
 
 
LILLY:
O.K. Let's hear it.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right, we will, we will see you later, Lilly. Thank you.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
All right. Now, I hope we haven't digressed too much, but...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Well we have. But we gotta break in a minute or so, then we'll 
come back...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Uh, what I was getting at is, John E. Gierum, an attorney, at one 
time senior litigation attorney for the Small Business 
Administration [SBA], which is *instrumentally* *tied* in those 
things that could put Clinton in jail, and his wife, with this 
whole business that David Hale is, and others, are "fingering" 
the President and, and the current governor of Arkansas, Jim 
"Guy" Tucker.
 
Now. These things... Also, Mr. Gierum supervised this $50 
million, $58 million, RTC contingency fund which disappeared from 
Chicago. And $50 million of it ended up in Little Rock to "make 
good" the $47 million that disappeared at the hands, some 
believe, of Hillary and Bill, from Madison Guaranty Savings and 
Loan. There's...
 
 
VALENTINE:
That's a lot more money than the press has ever talked about. And 
you talked about that on this show.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
More than once.
 
 
VALENTINE:
More than once.
 
All right, so there's a $50 million gambit involved here.
 
We've got a break coming up, Sherman. But we're gonna continue 
with Sherman Skolnick, folks. And we're summarizing now. We'll 
get to the latest developments before we're done.
 
I'm Tom Valentine. This is *Radio Free America*.
 
[...break...]
 
All right, we are back. We have Sherman Skolnick.
 
And Sherman, now we've got a nice good block of time for you to 
go right ahead and get us into the meat of this thing.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
All right. The unofficial office of the Resolution Trust 
Corporation [RTC], which is the S&L bailout group, is really in 
Chicago -- not the one that they list in Kansas City. It's inside 
a law office here: Hopkins and Sutter. They put away a $58 
million contingency fund when they merged Household International 
with a local, defunct S&L, that was "parked" -- that was RTC 
funds, $58 million -- that was "parked" with a, with Household 
International. Because a local contractor [Joseph Andreucetti, 
"The Andreucetti Affair", see Conspiracy Nation Vol. 1 Num. 70] 
had a claim against this defunct S&L. And so, since the claim was 
pending, they put away that money.
 
And Gierum, Gierum supervised that 58 million.
 
Now 50 million, *of* *that*, disappeared, and ended up with RTC, 
Little Rock, to underwrite the 47 million that disappeared 
*there* from Madison Guaranty Savings and Loan, of which a grand 
jury has been investigating and, purportedly, is prepared to 
accuse Bill and Hillary of misfeasance and bank embezzlement.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right, now you were told this by...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
..this over a year ago, on your show.
 
 
VALENTINE:
I know. You told this to us 'cause Gierum told you. Otherwise, 
nobody would know about it.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Right! But here's what happened.
 
In January of this year [1994], under the circumstances I told 
you, he kept coming up to me when I came to the courthouse. He'd 
run from the other end of the courthouse, right up to me, and 
stand right next to me and start making small talk! (Which was 
unusual.)
 
 
VALENTINE:
He evidently wanted to tell you somethin'.
 
Now where is he today?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
He is inside of a law office with an un... Get this: a lawyer 
with an unlisted number [laughs]. In Park Ridge.
 
We give out his number, however, though it's not listed. It's 
xxx-xxx-xxxx. He's in Park Ridge.
 
That's strange, for a lawyer to have an unlisted number.
 
 
VALENTINE:
I know. But why would you give out his number? If people would 
call him, what would they ask him? What would he tell 'em?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Well I give it out, basically, for other journalists.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Uh-huh [understands].
 
 
SKOLNICK:
The details that I'm discussing here...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Does he want to talk about this?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Well, the popular press didn't go into the details of his 
confession, which I'll get to in a minute.
 
So, I ended up in front of his [Gierum's] office. And he 
confessed to me in the presence of a former client, as a witness, 
that the White House is trying to "frame" him about this $50 
million and these other matters involving Clinton, and that he 
won't be able to defend himself, even though he's a skilled 
lawyer, because the thing is "wired", as they say. In other 
words, he was fearful that [the "fix" was in]... The only thing 
is that maybe, if I publicize it, maybe I can prevent him from 
getting "framed".
 
So we took the various points of his confession, we wrote it down 
just as he said it, and we put it into the record of this former 
client of his who's got a case pending. We sent the copy under 
the rules, as provided, to Mr. Gierum. And when it came up in 
court, Gierum didn't dispute it. So in a civil case, it's taken 
to be admitted. 'Cause when the time comes for him to challenge 
it, if he doesn't challenge it, it's taken to be admitted. Those 
are the rules. [CN -- But by "admitted" does Skolnick mean 
admitted into evidence or also an admission that the confession 
is true?]
 
So there is Gierum's confession in January '94 that relates to 
the current situation where sources close to Kenneth Starr are 
saying that there's a series of indictments coming, but that *so* 
*far* they're not gonna indict the President and the first lady. 
That is, *not* *yet*!
 
Now we happen to know a great deal about why they're delaying 
indicting the President and the first lady. First of all, they 
invoke "national security"; they feel the country is gonna be 
turned upside-down if the President is under indictment. I 
can't... The nearest that ever came to that was in '74 when a 
District of Columbia grand jury voted an indictment against Nixon 
which was squelched, and it wasn't discussed until 5 years later 
that there was such an indictment when Nixon resigned. Most 
people didn't realize that when Nixon was pardoned there *had* 
been a secret federal criminal indictment against him.
 
 
TOM VALENTINE:
Well, you see, in order to be pardoned he *had* to be indicted!
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Yeah! Legal...
 
 
VALENTINE:
You can't be pardoned without an indictment or a charge against 
you.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Right! Legal scholars wrote articles in the legal publications, 
law journals, of -- How is it that the incoming, appointed 
President, Gerald Ford, pardoned Nixon... from *what*!? I mean, 
what... And that was because there was a squelched, suppressed, 
secret indictment. And the foreman of that grand jury talked 
about it 5 years later.
 
O.K. So that... I'm just giving you a little historical there.
 
*Now*, what's happening is, the grand jury in Little Rock is 
gonna either name Clinton and his wife as co-conspirators, which 
is one *hair* away from actual federal criminal indictment. And I 
don't know how the President is gonna be able to continue, being 
named as a co-conspirator, because a co-conspirator generally is 
so named because he becomes a government witness against the 
other defendants!
 
In other words, David Hale, the former municipal judge, has 
"fingered" Clinton and his wife as being involved in a *massive* 
Small Business Administration series of...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Yes. David Hale literally has put out that he's willing to 
testify to this. And he probably already has told the grand jury 
that he was coerced into making these loans by the Governor at 
the time.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Right.
 
 
VALENTINE:
And under Small Business Administration rules, he was coerced 
into breaking the rules.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
The next step that I'm going to go into is a little complicated. 
And I'm gonna try my very best to make it in non-technical 
language.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right, the next step is very complicated so what we're gonna 
do is stop now. Because if you start on it, I'm gonna have to cut 
right in in about 15 seconds.
 
My guest is Sherman Skolnick. He is the Committee to Clean-up the 
Courts.
 
And you have a telephone number, quickly.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Uh, it's 731-1100, in Chicago, which is area code 312. That's a 
*regular* phone call [*not* a 900 number]...
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right. I'll plug it for ya.
 
I'm Tom Valentine. This is *Radio Free America*.
 
[...break...]
 
All right, we're talkin' with Sherman Skolnick, folks. And if 
you, any time, 7 days a week, 24 hours a day, there's a telephone 
number. It's not a special number; it's an ordinary telephone 
call. So in the middle of the night it won't cost you hardly 
anything. It's a 5-minute message. You dial 312-731-1100. That's 
the *Hotline*, from the Committee to Clean-up the Courts. And 
they've always got something juicy on it, wouldn't you say, 
Sherman?
 
 
SKOLNICK:
There's a summary of our discussion here today, about Clinton 
facing indictment.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right! So you're ready now to bring us up to...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Right. *Now*, so the Democrats control the Justice Department, 
right?
 
 
VALENTINE:
Yep.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
And they're well-aware of what Kenneth Starr, described in the 
popular press as a conservative Republican, special prosecutor 
appointed by, under special law, to go into these matters that 
the Justice Department would be disqualified to go into.
 
So Kenneth Starr is apparently gonna have the grand jury name 
Clinton and his wife as unindicted co-conspirators in a series of 
indictments involving former Justice Department official Webster 
Hubbell and the current Arkansas Governor, Jim "Guy" Tucker.
 
 
VALENTINE:
It would be pretty hard to indict Webster Hubbell and not indict 
his law partner from the Rose Law Firm [i.e. Hillary Clinton].
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Yeah. Well that's the problem they're dealing with. But they're 
being blackmailed and threatened. Because what happens is, on a 
previous program of yours I took an hour to explain how they shut 
down the cocaine smuggling operation at the Mena airport, 
Arkansas (which was under Clinton, as Governor), and have moved 
the dope operation just south of Chicago, to Joliet, where 
they're bringing in great loads of "China White" [heroin]. And 
the DEA and the FBI know all about it; I confronted their top 
people in October. And they won't *do* anything.
 
Now the reason for that is, the one that is arranging... that 
arranged this smuggling operation in '86, was Jim Thompson, who 
at *that* *time* was the [Republican] Governor of Illinois. He's 
still very powerful. He's a close crony of George Bush.
 
And so, the Democratic Justice Department, under Janet Reno, in 
so many words is saying, "O.K. You want to dirty-up the President 
and the first lady? Fine. We are gonna 'put to the wall' one of 
George Bush's closest cronies on a dope smuggling charge." And 
so, they've got the... there's a stand-off! In other words, they 
may not even indict, they may not even mention, Clinton and his 
wife as unindicted co-conspirators because Janet Reno's bunch is 
saying, "Hey! We're gonna put some [laughs], we're gonna put some 
Republicans to the wall!" [laughs]
 
 
VALENTINE:
You know that's, that's... There's a lot of people listening that 
would say, "Aww... come on. None of this can be true. People in 
that high-up [of a] bracket just don't get into things, don't do 
things like this. This is a lot of conspiratorial paranoia..."
 
 
SKOLNICK:
No, no, no, no, no. We... As I explained on a previous program, 
there was a Treasury [Department] unit investigating this dope 
smuggling since '83. Because it's a foreign thing, involving some 
espionage people bringing in "China White" (which is a very pure 
opium; it's high-purity), that the CIA and other espionage 
groups, the NSA and others, wanted... they didn't want it checked 
out! So the Treasury Department had compiled, in their unit, 
about 30,000 pages of surveillance reports. And they got very 
upset and (when they tried to shut down their operation) they 
turned it over to a private investigator. (And you can figure out 
who *that* might be.)
 
So, I mean...
 
 
VALENTINE:
It's hard to guess.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
[laughs] I mean, we know what we're talking about.
 
Thompson, our former Governor, is facing indictment. And it's a 
stand-off now whether Clinton and his wife will be named as 
unindicted co-conspirators...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Well why don't we indict 'em all!? That would be as juicy as 
"O.J." [Simpson]!
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Tom, as you know, I'm an independent: neither a Democrat nor a 
Republican -- "A plague on *both* their houses" -- *but*, I'm 
just reporting facts, as a journalist, of what is happening. I'm 
in favor of them, as a public-minded citizen, I'm in favor that 
they get Thompson, "Guy" Tucker, *and* Clinton and his wife! 
[laughs]
 
 
VALENTINE:
But the media, the media is sitting on this and they have access 
to this same information. But they don't... they're not gonna do 
anything.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Well if you read the *Los Angeles Times* story very carefully, 
they are saying... Kenneth Starr, the special prosecutor, is 
*not* *yet* going to indict Clinton and his wife.
 
Well that's interesting. I mean, the very fact that that comes up 
in the second paragraph of the story as re-printed in the 
*[Chicago] Tribune* on November 25th. It's all very interesting!
 
I mean, those that know the facts, that know various peoples at 
various levels of the government -- like ourselves, because we've 
been at this since 1958; we're not greenhorns, you know what I 
mean? We know what the basis of this story is! There's a stand- 
off!
 
Now *if* there is something unclear about this, it is because I 
try to put a complicated mess into non-lawyer language.
 
 
TOM VALENTINE:
No, I don't think you... It's very clear. I think you've done an 
excellent job of making it clear. The hardest job that you have, 
and that I have, is a thing called "credibility". You see, the 
*truth* is one thing; you can be absolutely sure...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
But wait a minute...
 
 
VALENTINE:
..it's true...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
There's a meeting, every other Tuesday, in the National Press 
Club, in Washington, conducted by Sarah McClendon and others. And 
William Sessions and his wife -- he's not in retirement; he's 
supposedly "in the doghouse"; they "sacked" him on the day before 
Foster was "knocked off".
 
 
VALENTINE:
Yeah! I'd *love* to get *him* on this show.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
But wait a minute! But he was *there*. And he, in so many words, 
*told* the fact that they "sacked" him to stop the White House 
from gettin', from Clinton and his wife getting put in jail! Now 
that's the bottom line, in the simplest, crudest terms. In other 
words, the day before the federal magistrate in Little Rock 
ordered the release of those records, which were in the custody 
of Foster in his office in the White House, that's the... later 
that day when they "sacked" William Sessions as the head of the 
FBI on these frivolous charges!
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right. My guest is Sherman Skolnick. I'm Tom Valentine. This 
is *Radio Free America*.
 
[...break...]
 
O.K. We are back, live. The final leg. My guest is Sherman 
Skolnick.
 
And you know, Sherman, we've got a situation with Vincent Foster 
similar to the John F. Kennedy thing: a lot of people just don't 
believe the official line.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Well, Patsy Thomasson, who was in with Dan Lasater, the convicted 
bond broker [who] went to jail for cocaine, she has been working 
in the White House and she, reportedly, is one of those that 
ransacked Foster's office, took away these documents (which 
apparently related to the SBA loans), [and] shipped them to 
Chicago to be used for blackmail.
 
Now that's the point that, in the remaining few minutes, I'd like 
to clarify. Chicago is very important in this. Because it was RTC 
in Chicago that got involved in the secret transfer of $50 
million of this RTC contingency fund (which was "parked" with 
Household International, as I said), [which was] sent to Little 
Rock RTC so as to try to cover up the apparent embezzlement of 
that S&L by Hillary and her husband!
 
Likewise, the SBA funds (the Small Business Administration 
funds), which are the, one of the key points of the David Hale 
case -- and he's turned around and said, "Hey! Don't look at me, 
look at Clinton and his wife. Look at the current Governor."
 
So Chicago is very instrumental in the thing.
 
*And*, you have to understand it from a cynical standpoint. The 
Republicans are saying, "Look. We're gonna get one of your 
current Governors down there, Jim 'Guy' Tucker, and a former 
Governor who's now the President, Bill Clinton and his wife." So 
the Democrats says, "Fine! And we're gonna put into jail one of 
*your* former Governors, Jim Thompson of Illinois! Close to Bush 
and so on." I mean they are threatening them, each other; it's 
everything short of shooting. I mean, we're cynical; we're 
waiting for bodies...
 
 
VALENTINE:
Well, you know, that... This is distressing. I don't like to see 
this kind of thing...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
But wait a minute! I'll tell you how distressing it is: the chief 
investigator of the RTC, that recommended the criminal indictment 
of Hillary and Bill, fell off a building!! And there's been some 
discussion, on *one* radio program, that the topmost thing was 
locked for the building and you couldn't get to the roof, and 
none of the security guards opened up the roof, therefore how did 
this body get *on* the roof and fall off the roof unless somebody 
*threw* it off the roof!?
 
There's a chief investigator for the RTC.
 
I mean, also, the chief of security of Clinton's Presidential 
campaign, Jerry Parks, was found murdered!
 
 
VALENTINE:
Yeah. We've talked with the Parks' boy.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
You know what that's about.
 
There's over 30 deaths! So this thing is so heated up, where 
they're saying, "Hey, you're gonna send away one of our Governors 
to jail -- fine. We're gonna get a couple of yours."
 
 
VALENTINE:
You know, it'd probably be the best thing that ever happened to 
this country, is to have the media discredited [CN -- You mean 
they're not *already* discredited!?] by having both sides expose 
each other, and force it out.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
You know what? I'd like for both sides to come on your program! 
[laughs]
 
 
VALENTINE:
Well I'd like... No, it's gonna take people like you, constantly 
digging...
 
 
SKOLNICK:
I don't mean to... I don't know what else to do but to laugh at 
something that is a political tragedy, all the way around.
 
The American people are being damaged, of course.
 
 
VALENTINE:
Yes.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
In other words, we've got a criminal in the White House. And to 
save himself, he doesn't say anything about Hillary's law partner 
that got, apparently, "knocked off", involved with these SBA 
loans. The SBA loan records were removed from Foster's office, 
sent to Chicago for some further *blackmail* -- I mean, this 
thing is getting to be like a Greek drama!
 
 
VALENTINE:
It sure is. And the only time I've heard "SBA loan" linked to 
Vincent Foster and documents is from you.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
And remember: Gierum, close with the Rodham family (he went to 
law school with Hillary's brother) -- and Gierum told me all 
about it in his confession, which is a part of the court record 
now. The point is, he was senior litigation attorney for the U.S. 
Small Business Administration.
 
 
VALENTINE:
All right. We're out of time.
 
Sherman, as usual, you've got us waiting to see what really 
happens. And I think you're way ahead of the game, again. Thank 
you very much for giving us your time.
 
 
SKOLNICK:
Thanks for listening, everybody.
 
 
VALENTINE:
And Sherman's number, folks, that call number is area code 312, 
731-1100. That is his "Hotline". And it's an easy call to make: 
312-731-1100.
 
Well! We've gotta stop for the alleged "news". And then we'll 
start again! Shortly.

 Brian Francis Redman    bigxc@prairienet.org    "The Big C"
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    Coming to you from Illinois -- "The Land of Skolnick"        
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